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Post by Uesugi on Aug 24, 2007 1:06:37 GMT -5
It is some strange wonder to me, on a site where writers come to share their stories, to tell their tales, that the general populace appears so illiterate as to not have the time to read perhaps a few pages of short, choppy prose, and then leave some suggestion, worded so carefully that, no matter how generic, it seems well thought out and sincere.
In fact, by merely pointing out an error small or imagined, one shows their caring and kind disposition, even if it is all for show. However, the general lack of opinions, thoughts, suggestions and comments reflects on one's ability to read. Even if one has these thoughts, thoughts pretaining to how good or bad a story may be, whether or not the story should go one way or another, and any other malady that may be formed by opinion alone, it proves nothing if the thought is kept silently in one's head for all eternity. By not vocalizing opinions one slowly loses a right to complain at the degeneration of the status quo. Thus, for all the amateur writers on this site who feel their writing could be leagues better, far improved from its current state, there is an entire community that can be blamed.
On this site the issue shifts between writer and readers. One can blame a stark lack of stories on the writers of the site, of course. It only lends to reason that, without writing, there is nothing to read. However, the writer is a careful breed. We tend to stick to our guns, but also like to have our egos stroked. When someone tells us anything about the stories we weave, our hearts thump in pride. Even in negativity, do we find some solace. Someone cared, we'll say, we'll think, someone cared enough to help us, to want us to be better.
So then, is it the storyteller's fault if he does not share in an empty bar?
The reader is a foundation of the writer. it is one of the many things that can keep them up and happy. The writer generally has stories swimming in their heads. They can write these stories for themselves, or to share with close friends. Sometimes they want to share these stories with others, with stranger. They want their stories in the public forum, for all to read and critique. So, when few listen, when few choose to hear, it is not unreasonable for the writer to, like a shamed actor or celebrity, retreat back to comfort.
By not reading, you are, in effect, destroying the material that you can read. It is no small wonder that very few write on a site where only two consistently read. As I said in a poem recently posted, it is not very hard to read the page or two of prose that most people put together with some form of ginger care and post. Nor is it hard to leave a comment, no matter how good or bad, no matter how kind or mean. It shows the writer that you care for their work. It shows them that you want them to improve.
but then, if my earlier suggestion that this site were illiterate were true, I should say few will even bother to read this.
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Post by Khornate Marksman on Aug 24, 2007 1:18:35 GMT -5
I read it and I agree with you Uesugi. Upon my return to the OSGW I plan to write more and comment a lot more. So you will be seeing more of me around here. And about the post I made following your poem, it was just a joke.
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Post by Uesugi on Aug 24, 2007 1:26:40 GMT -5
I hope, Hound, you forgive me my doubt, but it was not so long ago in a time some of us coined "Renaissance" and others "Revolution" that a few members said, so willingly, they would read more, they would try to read more... that they would be "doers". Today, only two can be said to still follow the spirit of that topic. So I do hope you forgive me for thinking this one more short-lived promise among many that seem to have plagued this site for quite some time.
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Post by me on Aug 24, 2007 10:58:15 GMT -5
I'm behind you with this Uesugi.
Actually, I really am interested in seeing how many people will take the time to read this, but I think that it shall be a small number.
Sometimes they want to share these stories with others, with stranger. S after strangers Uesugi, just in the spirit of this post.
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Post by Dagothkitty on Aug 24, 2007 11:23:03 GMT -5
It's not like It's like I won't be telling you something you guys don't already know, but for me to admit it now is a little different. I have lost most of my interest in writing, however I have no excuse for not reading. I am at guilt here. I don't know what my excuse is... there is none... I simply just choose not too. However, there are a few 'things' that kind of put me down below being in a mood of writing, and I guess I'm just too lazy to read. I've said I'd try to read and write more often, but ofcourse I never did. I don't know what to say... I would say that I will try to do both more often, but I'm afraid I'll let myself and the OSWG down again. Although I have not written anything in a while, and I had no excuse at that time, there is something that has popped up in my life that has just put me in a almost stupor state... and I'm not going into it. Uesugi knows though, but still, it is not an excuse for one not to read. I know reading can be a help one in a down time, but I never bring myself up to it. You two do not get enough recognition, and obviously that is Me (the user... damn name ) And Uesugi, for at least trying to keep the writing and reading spirit of the OSWG up, that was so powerful at one time (well... a lot more powerful then it is today). I admit my flaw, I don't know what to tell you. I guess I'll just try... it doesn't take immense skill or talent to read and comment, but... I dunno. I'm sure you'll tear this apart Uesugi, you were alwasy good at that. There is this time, however, where I get in this mood, and I just write. It's a rare thing... I don't know what brings it on. Other times when I try to write, I look at it and just think it flat out is terrible. And thinking that it's bad, I will definitley not post in on here, but I'm sure you guys would like that no matter how bad it is. I have an idea for a non-fiction story, about Radical Islam and the threats that they are, and I will bring myself to continuing 'The Mirror'. I just hope I'm not lying to myself again....
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Post by Uesugi on Aug 24, 2007 12:25:50 GMT -5
It's not like It's like I won't be telling you something you guys don't already know, but for me to admit it now is a little different. I have lost most of my interest in writing, however I have no excuse for not reading. I am at guilt here. I don't know what my excuse is... there is none... I simply just choose not too. However, there are a few 'things' that kind of put me down below being in a mood of writing, and I guess I'm just too lazy to read. Someone admits their guilt, that they are partially at fault? Takes a big man, Dagoth. At least I won't have to force it out of you now. However, an excuse is an excuse, and the only excuse I would accept is if you were providing for your family... I think Death is the only member old enough to do so... In fact I think he's the only married member, so he has the only valid excuse. Do you want to know something, Dagoth? There are many times I do not want to read the stories posted on this site. Some of them just don't strike my fancy, or feel terribly written, or I think the author went down the wrong route (though, very few even make it that far...). So, why do I bother? Perhaps it is poignant, or immature. Perhaps it is, in some small way, selfish... In my signature I state my Casus Belli, fifty-nine pages so far entirely unread by any member. If I were to add in all my other stories, it would perhaps grow to, for a safe estimate, 135 pages. Perhaps a bit more. I know what it feels like to know that no one but a small few actually like what you're writing. I know how it feels when you've poured so much effort into something, hoping it is good enough to be rea, but it is passed over: perhaps because few like you, perhaps because it is so badly written that it is not worth their time. And you want to know something Dagoth? I don't want others to feel that. Perhaps, though, that is why you can't seem to find the will to read... You know not the feelings of someone so alienated by an entire site. At least someone can admit to the shallow promises that have been offered time and again on this site. It is some small comfort, though... You keep addressing writing. Don't. First, I'm not in this for any recognition, and I'm sure Me isn't either. In fact, no one stands at my side right now besides myself. yes, perhaps it is my own troubles that drive me to do this, but ultimately it is something that effects the entire site. Next, Dagoth, is the fact that there never has been a reading spirit to this bloody site. Not once. Not once, not ever. When I first joined, only two members read the stories I wrote: Maliku and Death. Then, perhaps, November came and Death was slowly more busy, though Me could have been said to take his place. Still, only two, though one or two more crept up to read what I wrote. And then? It was just Me. And, aside from some short weekend in January, it has only been Me reading my stories. Aside from the period when I left in February and March, I have been a member since October 12, 2006, and not once, in all that time, have any but the three members I mentioned read what I wrote consistently. It depends on what you consider tearing, Dagoth. If this were about writing it would not be me who posted this topic. There has indeed been writing on this site, and though it is not enough, it is not regulated to only two members. However, the writing of others ultimately has no affect on me or many others on this site. We all end up focusing on our own writing. When it comes down to it, if our writing is under valued, there is no reason, what-so-ever, for it to be here.
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Post by GreyEidolon on Aug 24, 2007 13:16:35 GMT -5
Sounds like this is all about me. If you haven't noticed, empty promises are kind of my thing.
How do I justify this? Well, frankly, I can't. Often I tell myself "It's not like you're helping them", but that couldn't be further from the truth. Whenever someone compliments my work, I get this sudden rush, I feel elated- even aknowledged. However, I am a suprisingly selfish person, and I deny others this same feeling.
Forgive me, perhaps I am the one who needs to change to most. It's all just a matter of where to begin.
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Post by BloodMoonWolf on Aug 24, 2007 22:08:21 GMT -5
I'll honestly try to read more but frankly speaking I'm trying to balance working and being my senior year soon I'm more interessted in hanging with my friends than reading here. And the few chances i get to read i'm not aloud on the computer, because its too late and we have a rule in my house that once my dad goes to sleep i can't be on the computer(weird i know but what are you gonna do.) I mean I still have a life so i don't want to be on here all day long. But I'll make an honest attempt at reading. I mean this post is frankly posted at me any way not you grey. I have a story out and people comment but I don't give them the same treatment. I know its selfish but I'll try.
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Mr. Bubbles
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Post by Mr. Bubbles on Aug 24, 2007 22:15:43 GMT -5
I only read the first post, but I'll give my opinion and leave before Uesugi flames me. I don't think it's poor reading skill. It's apathy. People don't post replies because they can't be bothered to try. Or, in some cases, they are perhaps afraid. It'd suck to point out an error if it turns out that it didn't exist, you know? Or it could be lazziness. They don't write/read/comment simply because they don't want to enough to waste energy on it. That's my problem, at least. It generally is.
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Post by Uesugi on Aug 24, 2007 22:32:01 GMT -5
I only read the first post, but I'll give my opinion and leave before Uesugi flames me. Don't make me. I like comparisons. Particularly mean ones tend to rile people up. Also, there is a difference between laziness and apathy. Apathy is lack of caring, laziness is not wanting to do something right away, leaving it for another time. No, I don't know. But, what i do know, is even if it doesn't exist, ti shows them you care. Even if you really don't care. It also helps you learn. Learning is an important part of life. We should always learn. So, writing, reading, and helping others is a waste of time to you? I can think of many things to say here. It is only one thought that holds me back.
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Mr. Bubbles
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Post by Mr. Bubbles on Aug 24, 2007 22:42:48 GMT -5
You've missed my point by so much that I'll ignore everything you posted but this:
laziness is not wanting to do something right away, leaving it for another time.
That is not technically laziness. That is procrastination, which does not necesarily make you lazy.
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Post by Uesugi on Aug 24, 2007 22:45:08 GMT -5
No, I nailed your point right on the head, and debunked it. You don't wish to prove otherwise, however.
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Mr. Bubbles
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Post by Mr. Bubbles on Aug 24, 2007 22:50:47 GMT -5
You missed my point. And you will continue to until you get over yourself and learn to let go of grudges. You will never, ever see anything of value in anything I say so long as you hold a grudge - no, as long as you hate me. No matter what I do, you will find something wrong with it (real or imaginary). But you know what? I no longer care. You, your opinions, everything about you outside of your writing means nothing to me, and will until you stop this stupidity. And maybe not even then. You see, when you lose someones respect, it is very hard to earn it back, Uesugi.
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Post by Uesugi on Aug 24, 2007 22:55:56 GMT -5
I am curious what this grudge I have is, hamn? I hold no grudges. Every instance you seem to see dislike from me has always been sparked by yourself. From posting a useless comment in a poem, to not finishing one argument, and assuming I shall flame you here... I am reactionary, not an instigator. I always respond on the defensive. Perhaps what you see is what you want to see.
And it is interesting that writing you have not read means more to you than my own opinions and thoughts.
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etherealshadow
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Post by etherealshadow on Sept 5, 2007 19:29:38 GMT -5
*laughing* I know this isn't a funny kind of topic (don't flame me!) i was laughing at you two bantering like that. you missed my point.. no i didn't... yes you did.... no i didn't... *grin* i found it entertaining at least.
However, the writer is a careful breed. We tend to stick to our guns, but also like to have our egos stroked. When someone tells us anything about the stories we weave, our hearts thump in pride. Even in negativity, do we find some solace. Someone cared, we'll say, we'll think, someone cared enough to help us, to want us to be better.
*nods* i agree with you Uesugi. but i also agree with Hamn, on that most writers are simply apathetic and not illiterate. although, they can of course be both. not reading it in the first place because their apathetic.
*tilts head* i dont know nearly enough to get in between this spat. but from an outsiders point of view, Hman you seem tense or something. Uesugi, from an outsiders view, didnt display any hostility that would lend me to believe he held a grudge against you. it did seem a bit defensive, but he stated prevviously thats just how it comes across. i take it you two have some history?
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